I got a question from a regular reader the other day, and if you read my previous post rant about why I hate basement apartments this exact issue was reason number 1. Many basement apartments are not legal.
Reader Question
Hi Rachelle,
I have been following your blog for a few years now, and even recommended you to many other landlords I know, it’s a great resource, so thanks!
I have a question for you on basement apartments in Oshawa. When this situation came up, I thought you would be a good person to ask, as I believe you live or work in the Oshawa area, I think?
I have been renting out a basement apartment for about 10 years now in a previous house and now 2 years in my current house, without issue. These are not legal duplexes, just a basement apartment with seperate entrance, it’s own kitchen, bath etc. I just recently got a call from a city of Oshawa bylaw officer wanting to speak to me as there is a complaint about a basement apartment in my house. I am guesing one of the neighbours complained. I was surpised about this since I have rented this for 2 years now, and the previous owner did the same for about 3-5 years. I have not spoken to the bylaw officer yet, as I am still researching the issue, and am unsure on my stance and what I should say.
I am wondering if you have any advice on what I should do in this situation? Will they fine me? Is there anyway I can continue to rent or are they going to force my tenants out? Can I claim to be renting to friends and that it is not really a separate apartment? Any advice you can give me would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks very much,
Seriously Worried Landlord
The Answer
I do work in the Oshawa area but I have never had the pleasure of making a basement apartment legal yet in the Oshawa area. I do actually have one to make legal in Oshawa as we speak. In that case the height of the ceiling is too low in one area. We have to break out the floor in one section of the floor.
There is no easy answer…
Now That They Know You Exist…
Whenever you are dealing with government officials such as fire inspectors and bylaw enforcement officers you have found your new best friend. They have a lot of power to make your life miserable or not. So you want to be extra nice to them, find out what they want and do it as soon as possible so they will go away.
Believe it or not the officer themselves may well be your best source of information about what is required to get your basement legal if it’s even financially possible to do so. Just thank your lucky stars that basement apartments are legal in Oshawa. In Brampton and Mississauga unless your basement apartment is grandfathered in by the now defunct Ontario law your basement apartment is illegal.
Height Restrictions
The most expensive issue you can face is the height requirements for basement apartments. In that case you’ll have to crack up the existing floor and dig down, possibly underpin the foundation and then pour a new floor. It’s big money.
Fire Code Issues
You’ll need fire rated doors, 5/8″ drywall on the ceiling everywhere, and so much more…again it depends on the layout of your apartment and what the fire inspector wants.
Window Rules
There must be a window in every bedroom and windows large enough to get out of the apartment in case of fire. I’m not sure exactly how big exactly.
Unstated City Rules
Some cities like the city of Toronto are not going to give you a hard time as long as you’re fairly legal. They are not out to get you. In other cities that really don’t like basement apartments, they are really hard to get along with. The rules are much more strictly enforced. Oshawa is probably about 75% hard to get along with. I say this because they have made it difficult for students around the school and licensing all those apartments. I also read this article about the proposed changes to the zoning requirements for Oshawa basement apartments Plus the one I’m managing has been closed down.
The Funnel
Your problem now is that the powers that be know that you exist. From now on there’s only one direction and that’s to bend over comply with all their requirements. The fines for offenders can be up to $50,000. Usually they will not fine you, they’ll just make you remove the kitchen and disconnect the stove.
Other times they’ll just come by and inspect and nothing happens. That’s what happened when my idiot tenant called the city on me. I also told the genius that the city had declared the apartment illegal because of her report and she would have to move out. She moved. You have to love a good bluff.
The Problem
The major problem you are dealing with is that the rules are different in every city and the building and fire codes are very complicated and difficult to interpret. You’ll want to start your search for information here on the Oshawa web site. Then give the bylaw officer a call. I don’t really think that making up stories will work on them. I’d rather think they’d find it irritating, they just have a job to do.
It might be fine for all we know and you’re worried for nothing. Regardless you’ll want to tackle this issue as soon as possible.
Any other landlords been through this complex, confusing and convoluted issue and have advice for this landlord?
Mmmmmmm, by-law inspectors. Tasty.
Some ‘experienced’ points, with both Osh by-law and Ont fire code.
- I don’t know about basement apt licencing in Shwa personally, though they do have a two-unit bylaw that demands inspection, compliance with:
(i) the City’s Zoning By-law;
(ii) the City’s Property Standards By-law;
(iii) the Building Code Act, 1992, S.O. 1992, c. 23,
(iv) the Building Code, O.Reg 403/97,
(v) the Fire Protection and Prevention Act, 1997, S.O. 1997, c. 4, and
(vi) the Fire Code, O.Reg. 388/97.
- odd that by-law is coming first, I’d normally expect fire to ‘find time’ more promptly than by-law
- by-law guy will observe a two-unit in action, determine no licence has been sought or received and the party begins from there
- LL can expect approx $400 in fees & licence to go from compliant-but-unlicensed to compliant-and-fully-licensed (sched D of ‘Shwa General Fees)
- fire guy is actually the dragon, usually
- Odd that by-law guy is “asking” to come over – they have powers of entry that exceed those of the police and are usually equivalent to those of fire
- LL needs to review (esp) the Property Standards by-law for Shwa to find her deficiencies
- LL also needs to review ALL OTHER BYLAWS for their compliance – parking, fences, garbage, everything
- LL needs to read every line of every possibly-relevant bylaw – really – if she wants to know her legal obligations and effect compliance
- since LL is having visit by by-law and not fire the following aren’t officially on the agenda, but likely will be soon…
- re the *Regulations* for the Fire Protection and Prevention Act (usually known as “The Fire Code”); s. 9.8 governs “two-unit” dwellings; LL needs to ensure compliance
- this s. 9.8 is fairly readable:
http://www.e-laws.gov.on.ca/html/source/regs/english/2007/elaws_src_regs_r07213_e.htm
- LL will also need an electrical inspection (“General Inspection Certificate”) from ESA (per 9.8.6 (1)); she can call: 800-305-7383
- needs to provide “acceptable documentation from a qualified contractor” showing that HVAC & chimneys are up to snuff (s. 2.6.1.7)
- dunno where Rachelle gets the 5/8 drywall from – last Inspection Report I read required “1/2 inch fire code gypsum board (s. 9.8.3.3 (1))” for inter-occupancy separations, as well as furnace room walls & ceiling
- LL needs to stop finding ways to shirk her legal obligations and plotting deception of the safety inspectors. Duh.
Oh, to the Reader’s question(s):
- no they won’t fine you … at least for a while
- you’ll get inspected, told what to do, have 30 days to do it
- you can ask for extensions
- but you’ll eventually need to do what’s demanded
- if you refuse then ultimately you’ll be in line for $25/$50K fines, up to a year in jail (esp for fire stuff)
- AIUI they won’t force out the T – the LL will just have to comply with the Orders, or face fines and possible jail time; the T just keeps renting and is oblivious to it all
Interesting topic! Thanks for sharing this information! Great job Rachelle.
Rachelle got spammed…
Once I hire a full time webmaster… It’ll never happen again
I believe the poster saying the tenant does not have to move out is wrong…
Unless your by-law is different… According to Georgetown’s by-laws (similar to Brampton/Toronto’s) they give you 30 days to move to a new apartment, and the land lord is responsible for ALL moving costs… And they have to fix the apartment (expensive) or pay the even more expensive fine
I have a landlord who doesnt yet realize I have her by the balls…
She lives upstairs, and several nights she had started playing music at 1am on weekdays… That and she has rules like… No shower between 7 & 8… No laundry except at night (bullshit, considering me and my brother cant stay up all night…) And recently no loud music before 11… We had an agreement from the beginning, that noise is not a problem – She blasts her music loud, and so do I….
Also, she had a lease agreement (apparantley now over) that had millions of grammatical errors in it… And recently she drew up a notice, and signed it, stating that we requested early termination of the lease agreement. This was pure bullshit, neither myself or my brother requested it…. Further more, the only signature on it is hers… My brother did sign, but considering I did not, and on the lease BOTH of us signed, its not legally binding… We could argue it and move out in september, making it hard for her to rent/sell the house. I figure we got a ‘get out of hell early’ card.
so after all that nonsense, and her breaking one of my plants in the garden, I am feeling nasty enough to report her illegal establishment.
We are due to move out in one or two months, so considering this is the last rent payment for me, I am breaking every single one of her rules, and making her life a living hell….
If after, I feel I still have not had enough revenge, I will report her to the bylaw officers, as well as the CRA.
She could get royally screwed, and I dont know if she knows this yet… I’m not telling her, I will only hint it. I would rather her be blind-sided by it and put her in a tight spot financially, and well… residentially haha!
I also forgot to mention, if she has a rule like no showering between 7 & 8, then that means her water tank is not large enough to support two units, which I believe is breaking a by-law. I know for a fact, if it were a legal apartment, she would have a proper sized water heater.
I think I will report her either way, as soon as we find a new place to move to… Just because for the past year, I could hardly call this place ‘home’. Having to conform to such rules is ridiculous…
I was right you are a fuckwad, clearly you have nothing to do you entitled waste of oxygen.
You sound like a real fuckwad. I wish you a big fat punch in the face. The end.
How immature can you be? Let’s ruin her life because she pissed u off. grow up
I am the fuckwad? I completley disagree… I am the one getting screwed by a landlord… Or am I misunderstanding you and you know the landlord personally? I think either way you are the fuckwad judging by the lack of intelligence in your reply. I hope you fail, either your in on the scam or your still a fuckwad (in your own words) and stupid for feeling bad for the landlord when the tenant is clearly the one distressed and in proper legal positioning…
woah rachelle why all the misguided hate. you must be new to the internet. lol. , i feel your pain man. you should do whatever you want to make your landlord unhappy. people are entitled to peaceful enjoyment of their shit. my stupid packie landlord never turns down his fucking tv volume. i think he has speakers inside the party wall or something its so stupid loud sand nigger speak. so i put a speaker against the wall and play Metallica and lamb of god as loud as i can every time that fat shit disturbs me.
Of course the list goes on from being locked out of the garage where my washing machine is to the curry smell that gets so bad i cant have guests over. its so bad i cant believe these foul ghouls put that shit inside their bodies everyday. in return for that i have taken up smoking weed inside instead of leaving for a nice walk. i say fuck him. shit landlords that trick you into a illegal suite deserve to lose their house.
You sound like a charmer, I can’t imagine why you’re living in such horrible circumstances, I think your landlord would agree that you should move because your living conditions are so stressful.
I completely agree with both of your comments. These are stupid little girls who need to grow up. I understand that these landlords are being jerks but the mature thing to do is move. I can’t imagine not caring about ruining someone’s life. And towards trips comment about your misguided hate? Lmao she is a racisit little bitch